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Post by Aitou Kaichi on Dec 13, 2011 9:05:25 GMT
Interesting game... Also, it is possible to lose with a profit, on purpose. (Just don't bid on anything). Doing so guarantees your loss, but you still get 50M. If that's enough to cover your debt, and you want out of the game, then it becomes a valid option.
Which leads to a potential strategy for Akiyama: If exactly one player loses, he might choose to cover the rest of their debt for them after they remove the 50M.
And of course, the trap noticed by Nao is obvious: If everyone bids too much, the LGT will collect money with this game.
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Post by Ishida Katsuo on Dec 13, 2011 10:05:25 GMT
this is going to be awesome, there is so much that can happen and i really hope this doesnt get cut short.
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Post by Yomohiro Rie on Dec 13, 2011 14:27:07 GMT
If that really is the trap that Nao noticed, then it's kind of anti-climatic... it's too obvious then...
And I agree - oh, and wouldn't it be interesting if the manga comes up with an idea that our dealers already used? ^^
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Post by Barbaro on Dec 15, 2011 10:32:27 GMT
The trap (if not the lesser obvious trap) is that to enter the subsequent bids, you have to trash your cards first. Meaning, that just because you trash cards, it doesn't mean you're in ANY way, shape, or form going to get cards back because you could lose the bids. And you know what happens then? You're incredibly vulnerable to being ganged up on as the Pig... possibly even from the first round.
Of course, that would mean players would have to trash cards as well to enter that auction and deliberately keep you out. If there are 5 lots open, and let's say they know you trashed 3 cards in the first round, all players have to do is trash 1 card and bid for lots with 3 cards or more, effectively locking you out.
If you're getting locked out, you'd have to bid VERY high on a lot to overcome it, or on lots of little lots. It's possible to cause a reversal near the 5th round, by staying as the Pig and bidding almost nothing and letting people gang up on you... after they've spent a ton of coins bidding for 4 rounds trying to keep you as the pig, drop a high amount on one or more of the sets you know they'll want to take from you that no one player can possibly match, and let the players who trashed cards rot as Pigs with no chance of a comeback.
Then you could theoretically have three lots off of that fifth bid, meaning you could have a hand of about 10 cards, which is very likely to give you a hell of a good hand and put you at the top while effectively locking out multiple players immediately simply for not having enough cards.
...At least that's what I think is an optimal strategy at first glance.
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Post by Barbaro on Dec 15, 2011 11:25:14 GMT
Actually, I re-read the rules. You don't even GET a starting hand. You have to buy one within 5 rounds, all while people who do get starting hands are changing cards and getting an even bigger lead. It's misleading to say you can change your cards up to 5 times: you can really only change your cards as many times as you can get within 5 rounds. If you get your hand in the third round, you can only change twice.
That means that you could, in theory, be locked out from even GETTING a hand if someone trolls you for all 5 rounds (i.e. Nao gets trolled, cause duh). You'd be a pig with 0 cards to your name.
Of course, with that in mind, there's an easy method to win. A player who's willing to lose on purpose and get paid back by Nao and Akiyama just has to not bid on anything. And in theory, all of the players except Nao, Akiyama, and a third just have to follow suit from the very beginning. They'd each be freed from the tournament, each with a 200M bonus, and clear their debts, while Nao and Akiyama walk with the prize money to free other individuals. And that's why Harimoto and his drones are there... to tank that and ultimately take the top 3 spots, locking Nao from paying anyone. Plus, the more players that drop out, the more money Harimoto and his cronies get.
Anyhoo, aside from all that, I'd say the strongest hand you can go for from the beginning is the one with 6 cards. You can change 1 card and be safe while in the change phase. Ideally bid on the hand with 4 cards. It doesn't matter what they are, because with that many cards in your hand you're likely to get something better than anyone else.
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Post by Barbaro on Dec 15, 2011 11:35:51 GMT
And going even further:
I bet you Nao is going to convince everyone to just not bid on anything. Everyone's going to go "Excuse me?" as usual, then realize they could walk away with an easy 50M bonus (since 300M -150M for losing -100M for the LGT collection is 50M), plus getting Nao and Akiyama all of the prize money that could be paid back to clear any extra outstanding debts.
Then when Harimoto and his crew bids on cards on the first round, they'll realize that they're screwed, and everyone goes "!" in a dramatically pointy speech bubble.
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Post by Aitou Kaichi on Dec 25, 2011 10:16:38 GMT
Merry christmas, everyone! There's a new chapter to help you celebrate!
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Post by Ishida Katsuo on Dec 25, 2011 10:55:18 GMT
man harimoto's girls are bad actors, they couldnt have made it more obvious that they are going to backstab nao with all those dirty looks and sneaky lines. and frankly thats bad writing as well, i know writing them that way builds them as antagonists and lays the seeds for the betrayal, but we already know they are going to so the true shock build would have harimoto's girls being 100% enthusiastic and not the least bit sneaky leaving the readers with the tiniest doubt they arent going to do what we expect them to do. we KNOW they are sneaky, you dont need to make them act that way coz it just cements whats going to happen next in a manga about twists and surprises. oh and this chapter also re-affirms baldy as one of the most annoying characters in the entire manga
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Post by Aitou Kaichi on Dec 25, 2011 20:33:49 GMT
I'm clearly missing something... Baldy didn't have any lines in this chapter. It was the dealers and the 4 bid poker participants.
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Post by Barbaro on Dec 26, 2011 19:50:22 GMT
Nao's lost before the game has even really begun.
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Post by Sagaro on Jan 4, 2012 16:09:43 GMT
Chapter 144 is up.
Thoughts, guys?
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Post by Kuwabara Kimura on Jan 4, 2012 19:27:52 GMT
I think Kimura will bid on the K while Mikamoto will bid on the 10. That would end with Mikamoto getting 1st place with a AA, Kimura at 2nd place with a KK and Saeki 3rd with a 10 10 (or QQ if he bids on LOT B).
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Post by Barbaro on Jan 5, 2012 4:17:39 GMT
It's pretty obvious that's what WOULD happen. I have a feeling Nao doesn't care about losing if she already "achieved her goal", although considering she knew she'd get betrayed she likely has the foresight to know what Mikamoto and Kimura were up to.
With the current hands, as far as I can tell, there is no way for Nao to win, even if she bid on all of the lots and won them all. Her best move is to lose on purpose. And given her "goal", that's probably what she will do.
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Post by Aitou Kaichi on Jan 5, 2012 4:20:16 GMT
I still can't figure out why Saeki betrayed Nao. He gains nothing from it.
Also, if she bids on all the lots and wins, she gets 3rd place, coz one of Harimoto's girls end up with only 4 cards.
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Post by Barbaro on Jan 5, 2012 5:30:12 GMT
She's not going to do that. Remember, this is Nao. "Don't let money go to the LGT guys! That's bad!"
But then again, if she does think the practice round is such a trifle, she might as well let some of that bonus money go to send the message to not mess with her when it comes to that, because if she has to she WILL hand yen over to the LGT.
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